When a Christian Makes Contact with an Atheist
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Neither holds any water because it's unfalsifiable. You could as logically argue it was created just now and our memories of the prior post history is part of the creation.
If it was created now, then there still is a God.
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What's that?
That there is one Lord- Jesus of Nazareth, commonly called the Christ, who was born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried. On the third day He rose again from the dead. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty. He will return in glory to judge both the living and the dead, and His kingdom will have no end.
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That there is one Lord- Jesus of Nazareth, commonly called the Christ, who was born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, dead, and buried. On the third day He rose again from the dead. He ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of God the Father almighty. He will return in glory to judge both the living and the dead, and His kingdom will have no end.
ah I see. I misunderstood - when you said "I’d rather pick what is actually true", you meant you'd pick a story you like and call it truth. Yes that's also an option, why not.
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ah I see. I misunderstood - when you said "I’d rather pick what is actually true", you meant you'd pick a story you like and call it truth. Yes that's also an option, why not.
I'm convinced from the historical evidence that Jesus actually rose from the dead
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I'm convinced from the historical evidence that Jesus actually rose from the dead
I'm convinced from the evidence that God doesn't care what we believe. If there even is such a thing, and I don't think it's possible to meaningfully answer that, there are many better ways to communicate vital information to people on earth other than choosing someone to relay your messages in a way that is indistinguishable from a mentally ill person who just hears voices in their head.
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It's debatable if those cults are even protestant (some don't even fall under historical Christianity) as protestants are continuing groups that came out of the reformation, believing the Roman Church erred (Think Episcopal/Anglican, Presbyterian, Lutherans, Moravians, etc. They all stem from the pre reformation Catholic Church), while a lot of culty groups are like "yeah the past 2000 years the church was wrong so we are starting over again" (restorationists). But even them, some groups are still recognisably Christian (Baptists, most Pentecostals, non denomonational) believing in the historical Christian doctrine of the Trinity and the sacraments. Then you get the spinoff groups such as Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses. And then there are the in betweeners such as Quakers and SDAdventists where it's debatable.
Okay I'm just infodumping now. This isn't relevant.
No, it's relevant actually. I called them protestant, but the OG Lutherans aren't a branch of Catholicism, so why would Pentecostals be a branch of protestantism? Yeah, they're still anti-pope, but they also found enough problems with the established protestants to split off and start something else.
I don't know if there's a term for the wave of new denominations in the last century, if it's even a single wave at all. Revivalism? And is there a common theme in that wave that leads to cults? Or should we say that the cults are a wave in themselves, caused by some other shift in the zeitgeist? Because as much as I'd like to blame pentecostalism for cultish beliefs (and I think I could make that argument), it could also be a general secularization that strips communities to their cultish cores.
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I did not ask what you meant in your sentence.
You kinda did.
"Is that a crazy way to phrase..."
And now I've answered it twice, from two different angles. You're going to have to rephrase your question if you're not satisfied at this point, because I don't know what you want from me.
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Jesus mainly spoke about the Kingdom, which is within us and not something otherworldly
Jesus spoke more about hell than heaven. And more about hell than anyone else in the Bible.
Paul is quite clear.
1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Romans 2:12-16
For all who have sinned without the law will also perish without the law, and all who have sinned under the law will be judged by the law. For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but the doers of the law who will be justified. For when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law. They show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, while their conscience also bears witness, and their conflicting thoughts accuse or even excuse them on that day when, according to my gospel, God judges the secrets of men by Christ Jesus.
Romans 3:22-25
the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins.
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
I looked to first link, and the first biblical reference was Luke 16:23. It's a parable… not a description of actual hell… I saw enough to know that it's not theologically serious.
The rest of your message is cherrypicking. You can't cite verses without providing any context or analysis, staying on the surface of things, and think you make a point. Again, not theologically serious. You should study the Bible praying, make it resonate with the life of the marginalized people that Jesus came to meet, not just choosing the verses that confirm your preconceptions, or you'll make the Bible saying the contrary of what it says by cherrypicking and staying too literal. Nobody can make this work for you.
Imagine someone who'd come to you and say: “the Bible say that God doesn't exist, look at Ps 14:1 ‘There is no God’!”. Of course this Psalm says the contrary, and it would be easy to prove, just by citing the verse wholly; but what you do is not different, just more subtle.
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You know, as reasonable as it is, the last paragraph does sound totally corny. I'd be fine dating someone who's not as much of a nerd as me, or is a nerd in a different way like movies.
Especially the bookshelf part, since in my experience, a lot of people with piles of books don't read them (I gave the worse ones away), and making a dating app pic in a library isn't the first thing that comes to mind.
Yeah, and most of the ladies leaning on the hoods of expensive sports cars don't own those cars.
I haven't read most of the books on my shelves because I'm very ambitious about reading. I read a lot, but I buy about twice as many books as I finish because I'm interested in so many topics. I'm just describing how a person portrays themselves, not whether they've read every book, mastered an instrument, or hiked all the best trails.
Oh, and here's one that I forgot. I never engaged anyone who took a pic in a mirror in a public bathroom. I don't know why people do that. Set your phone on a timer pretty much anywhere else and take a full body pic with a background that's anything else.
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I looked to first link, and the first biblical reference was Luke 16:23. It's a parable… not a description of actual hell… I saw enough to know that it's not theologically serious.
The rest of your message is cherrypicking. You can't cite verses without providing any context or analysis, staying on the surface of things, and think you make a point. Again, not theologically serious. You should study the Bible praying, make it resonate with the life of the marginalized people that Jesus came to meet, not just choosing the verses that confirm your preconceptions, or you'll make the Bible saying the contrary of what it says by cherrypicking and staying too literal. Nobody can make this work for you.
Imagine someone who'd come to you and say: “the Bible say that God doesn't exist, look at Ps 14:1 ‘There is no God’!”. Of course this Psalm says the contrary, and it would be easy to prove, just by citing the verse wholly; but what you do is not different, just more subtle.
I don't deny that Jesus came to marginalised people. He came to free them, redeem them, and forgive them. He didn't sit around and say "you do you, live your truth". He said "take up your cross, and follow Me".
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No, it's relevant actually. I called them protestant, but the OG Lutherans aren't a branch of Catholicism, so why would Pentecostals be a branch of protestantism? Yeah, they're still anti-pope, but they also found enough problems with the established protestants to split off and start something else.
I don't know if there's a term for the wave of new denominations in the last century, if it's even a single wave at all. Revivalism? And is there a common theme in that wave that leads to cults? Or should we say that the cults are a wave in themselves, caused by some other shift in the zeitgeist? Because as much as I'd like to blame pentecostalism for cultish beliefs (and I think I could make that argument), it could also be a general secularization that strips communities to their cultish cores.
The common wave that leads to cults are generally Restorationists, from what I find.
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I'm convinced from the evidence that God doesn't care what we believe. If there even is such a thing, and I don't think it's possible to meaningfully answer that, there are many better ways to communicate vital information to people on earth other than choosing someone to relay your messages in a way that is indistinguishable from a mentally ill person who just hears voices in their head.
What better ways to communicate exist?
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What better ways to communicate exist?
Seems like there's a lot of ways, no? A talking immortal dog, just off the top of my head. That would be hard to counter, especially after the first 500 years and it's still there, spouting the word of god in any language you like.
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But you'll just be dust someday
We're not dust yet. There is no reason why our eventual death and non-existence should preclude us finding meaning in our present existence.
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I don't deny that Jesus came to marginalised people. He came to free them, redeem them, and forgive them. He didn't sit around and say "you do you, live your truth". He said "take up your cross, and follow Me".
What are you doing, citing verses without understanding them in their context, if not “living your truth”?
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What are you doing, citing verses without understanding them in their context, if not “living your truth”?
Exegesis.
I do understand the context of Jesus' verses. He was very literal on the existence of Hell.
Matthew 8:8-13
[8] But the centurion replied, “Lord, I am not worthy to have you come under my roof, but only say the word, and my servant will be healed. [9] For I too am a man under authority, with soldiers under me. And I say to one, ‘Go,’ and he goes, and to another, ‘Come,’ and he comes, and to my servant, ‘Do this,’ and he does it.” [10] When Jesus heard this, he marveled and said to those who followed him, “Truly, I tell you, with no one in Israel have I found such faith. [11] I tell you, many will come from east and west and recline at table with Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob in the kingdom of heaven, [12] while the sons of the kingdom will be thrown into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” [13] And to the centurion Jesus said, “Go; let it be done for you as you have believed.” And the servant was healed at that very moment.
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Seems like there's a lot of ways, no? A talking immortal dog, just off the top of my head. That would be hard to counter, especially after the first 500 years and it's still there, spouting the word of god in any language you like.
People would just come up with a scientific explanation for that immortal dog, if they hadn't locked it away in the middle of nowhere already
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You kinda did.
"Is that a crazy way to phrase..."
And now I've answered it twice, from two different angles. You're going to have to rephrase your question if you're not satisfied at this point, because I don't know what you want from me.
You're misquoting me. I think if you read my comment you would find it easier to understand.
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You're misquoting me. I think if you read my comment you would find it easier to understand.
I'm going to congratulate you. It's taken me several replies before realising that you're a troll - you have gotten further than most.
Kudos.
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I'm going to congratulate you. It's taken me several replies before realising that you're a troll - you have gotten further than most.
Kudos.
Literally... just read the comment. It does not say what you just said it does...
Do you often assume people are out to get you instead of double checking if your assumption was correct?